Dean Regas chats with Mark Armstrong, son of Neil Armstrong, about the Apollo 11 moon landing. Listen in to learn about Mark's upbringing under the lunar spotlight, and his current work with the Vantage Earth Foundation.
Send us your thoughts at lookingup@wvxu.org or post them on social media using #lookinguppodcast
Additional resources referenced in this episode:
- Apollo 11 Real-Time Mission Experience
- From the archives: Apollo 11 begins journey to moon on July 16, 1969, CBS News
- Historic Apollo 11 Moon Landing Footage, NASA
Episode Transcript:
Looking Up is transcribed using a combination of AI speech recognition and human editors. It may contain errors. Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
Dean Regas: When I was a kid, I had absolutely no idea what I wanted to be when I grew up. I took that test in middle school—that career aptitude test—and this was to help figure out what I was going to do as a career when I grew up. So I answered all the questions truthfully and honestly, filled in all the boxes.
And so what would the 1980s-era computer tell me that I should become?
Well, you think it would've told me something about my aptitude towards astronomy, public speaking. But what did the computer say? What did the test tell me that I should become when I grow up? It said I was destined to be a florist.
From the studios of Cincinnati Public Radio, I'm your host, Dean Regas, and this is Looking Up, the show that takes you deep into the cosmos—or just to the telescope in your backyard—to learn more about what makes this amazing universe of ours so great.
My guest today is Mark Armstrong, space educator and son of astronaut and first person to walk on the Moon, Neil Armstrong.
Yeah, a florist. Hmm. Boy, those tests were really accurate, weren’t they? I mean, where the heck did that come from? I mean, earthly. Grounded. Introverted. Yeah, that's definitely not a space podcaster.
I'm thinking about this a lot because I'm about to talk with a man who perhaps had a future mapped out for him by forces outside of his control—or maybe by an illustrious father who is arguably the most famous person of the 20th century.
I'm talking about Mark Armstrong, the son of Neil Armstrong. I mean, here his dad comes back from the Moon to fame and celebrity like nothing ever known. I mean, it's Neil Armstrong, first guy to walk on the Moon, but he's still just a dad too. What must that have been like to grow up in the Armstrong home?
Mark Armstrong: Hello everyone. My name is Mark Armstrong, and I've been around the space exploration program for a long time.
Dean Regas: Well, Mark, thanks so much for joining me today.
Mark Armstrong: Of course, happy to be here.
Dean Regas: I think to the outside observer, your father Neil Armstrong was larger than life, but you know, he was kind of full of unknowns.
How would you describe your dad as a person post-Apollo, like when you were older—and how would you describe him?
Mark Armstrong: Well, he was a quiet guy, but not always. He loved to talk about airplanes. He loved to talk about aviation, especially when it comes to how to make something better.
He was also, Dean, well-versed on many topics. He read constantly. He was always reading and absorbing material, and he had a great memory. So he had a way of weaving things together that’s unusual, I think—especially before the internet age.
After the space program, he decided to become a professor at the University of Cincinnati, and I think that was something that was really well suited for him. He loved to teach, he loved to share his knowledge—especially with other people that had similar passions.
And I think it gave him an opportunity to fulfill his childhood dream, which was to become an airplane designer.
Dean Regas: Well, so take us back to your childhood, the month of July 1969, and this is launch day for Apollo 11, July 16th. I know you were pretty young. How old were you at the time of Apollo 11?
Mark Armstrong: I was six.
[NASA Archival Audio]: ...And it's just five minutes to the historic launch of Apollo 11. With all going well, astronauts Armstrong, Collins, and Aldrin sitting there atop the great Saturn rocket in their command module getting ready for launch.
Dean Regas: Can you remember what your home life was like before your dad landed on the Moon?
Mark Armstrong: Well, I think before he landed on the Moon, home life was very similar to everyone else's home life who's had one or the other parent with a full-time job. And in my case, I probably saw less of my father during those early years than I would've liked because when he was on a mission for approximately nine or ten months beforehand, they were pretty rigorously training, constantly working on that mission, and there were many problems to solve. But he was still home at night, and we had dinners just like a normal family. And yeah, I think it was a pretty normal existence.
Now when it comes to the actual launch of Apollo 11, recognize that Dad left for that mission something like ten days, perhaps even two weeks before the mission started, because he and the other astronauts needed to go basically stay in isolation. They were trying to minimize the chances of anybody getting sick or carrying a virus onto that flight.
And he and Buzz and Mike were in a little cabin near the beach of Cape Kennedy. That's where they stayed until it came time to suit up. We, of course, went to the launch, and my mother and my brother and I were on a little boat on the Banana River, and that's where we watched the launch.
[NASA Archival Audio]: 6, 5, 4, 3, 2, 1, 0. All engines running. Liftoff.
We have a liftoff...
Mark Armstrong: And of course, after the launch, we flew back home, and then during the entire mission, we had an open house. And this was customary for any astronaut family that was on a mission. You had an open house the entire time. Neighbors and relatives and friends would just be coming in and out of the house at all hours, often bringing food in.
And it was a central gathering point for two reasons. One, because the family obviously had a loved one on the flight, but secondarily because we had a squawk box in the house. And a squawk box allowed us to listen to air-to-ground transmission and kind of know what was happening.
[NASA Archival Audio]: This is Bruce McCandless. I just wanted to make sure you all are getting a signal over your squawk box and everything's okay.
Mark Armstrong: And of course there was always someone there—another astronaut. In our case, Bill Anders was often in the house. Pete Conrad was just down the street. Or you had someone from NASA, like one of their public relations folks, and they would be there to kind of explain what you were listening to.
[NASA Archival Audio]: Well, I could do like I’ve done and go sit at some wife’s house that’s got squawk box...
Mark Armstrong: Because there's so much jargon in the everyday communications that a layperson wouldn't necessarily know. We had a translator, if you will.
[NASA Archival Audio]: At three minutes downrange—70 miles, 43 miles high—velocity...
Mark Armstrong: So during that entire mission, we were surrounded by people, and I think that was good, especially for my mother, who, of course, I think internalized the dangers and the risks much more so than my brother and I as children.
Dean Regas: Well, and I have this image in my mind of you and the entire family sitting around the TV on July 20th, when Neil took the first steps on the Moon. What do you remember from that moment? Did your mom let you stay up that late to watch it? And did you see it live, like so many folks?
Mark Armstrong: Oh yeah, I did see it live. So I was obviously awake for the landing, and then I think my mom had me take a nap because there were several hours in between the landing and the lunar EVA. So she woke me up and I sat in front of the television with a bunch of family members and friends and neighbors around.
And what I remember from that was it was really hard to see what you were looking at and to know what you were looking at—especially as a 6-year-old with not a lot of frame of reference. It was very shadowy and, you know, just difficult to see until you watched it long enough to kind of process what you were seeing. Right.
[NASA Archival Audio]: At these low sun angles, there's no trace brown. It's now returned gray appearance. Like the acreage doesn't... has the look of a plaster of Paris to it at this sun angle, which is completely lacking at higher angle.
Dean Regas: Well, I hope you had the front-row seat. I mean, I hope you were, you know, front and center in front of the TV in front of everybody else, right?
Mark Armstrong: I was very small, so I was on the floor, and everyone was seated behind me. So yeah, it was a front-row seat. You know, we were all huddled around, I think, like a lot of American families and a lot of people around the world.
Dean Regas: Well, it's so famously called "one small step for a man," but also kind of a giant moment in your life too. I mean, how did the Moon landing affect you growing up, going to high school and beyond—for you and your brother too?
Mark Armstrong: Well, let me start by saying, I mean, obviously I've had great opportunity as a result, and I'm very fortunate in that respect. But I will say that for the family in general, especially after the flight, it was difficult for us. There was no NASA training or preparation for families to handle the kind of exposure and the kind of fame and the kind of issues that come along with that. So we were just trying to sort it out day by day.
As a 6-year-old, I was largely ignored. And to be honest, that's still quite true.
But for my parents especially, you know, it was a challenge to try to continue to live the lifestyle that they imagined for themselves, which was pretty much: keep to yourselves, keep your head down, keep your nose clean, stay out of trouble, and be a normal family with normal issues.
That was a struggle, I think, and we certainly had to learn how to make adjustments. It was very important to my parents for our family to stay grounded and for our family to just sort of try to go about our business, if you will.
Dean Regas: So, what legacy do you think not only your father left you, but just the whole Moon mission in general? How did it inspire you, and what projects are you working on now that might have come a little bit from this?
Mark Armstrong: Well, Dean, one of the great things that came from our trips into space and going to the Moon was actually coming back from the Moon and looking at the Earth with fresh eyes.
In 1968 on Apollo 8, Bill Anders took this amazing photo of the Earth over the lunar surface called Earthrise, and that photo prompted an entire environmental movement and actually led to Earth Day. And it was Bill Anders himself that said, "We came all the way to the Moon, and what we discovered was the Earth."
[NASA Archival Audio]: The most meaningful words to me that I've heard for a number of years is that the Moon is of little significance unless it's just the beginning. And I think we all believe that that's very, very true.
Mark Armstrong: And I think that one of the great legacies of the Apollo program is that we have a fresh perspective on our planet. Once you're away from the Earth, you can look around, and the Earth is the only thing that you see that looks habitable—and it’s by far the best place in the neighborhood. So it's something that we have to take care of.
And along those lines, I am in the process of creating a nonprofit organization called Vantage Earth Foundation to educate people—primarily through music and the arts—about the issues of long-term sustainability for this planet.
And no matter what your political affiliation is, when you see microplastics in our oceans and infiltrating the food chains, you have to feel responsible.
You have to feel responsible for what we've done to the planet. And there's so much more that we can do.
And this foundation is really focused on educating people about the problems—and the solutions—to making this planet the best place to live for the long haul.
Dean Regas: Well, Mark, thanks so much for chatting about your family, your personal experiences, and giving us a glimpse of not only your famous father but your family too.
Mark Armstrong: Well, thanks for having me on the show, Dean. Obviously, I really appreciate it. We go way back, and I've always appreciated your friendship, and I am a big fan of what you're doing. And please keep doing it. So yeah.
Dean Regas: I did not become a florist after all. So my parents—I mean, my dad was an electrical engineer, and my mom was a teacher. I always think like, I wonder what they thought I would be.
Stan Regas: My name is Stan Regas, and I’m the father of Dean Regas.
Becky Regas: I'm Becky Regas, also a parent of Dean Regas.
Dean Regas: When I was a kid, I took that career aptitude test—the one that they gave to, like, middle schoolers—and it told me that I should become a florist. What did you think I was going to grow up to be?
Stan Regas: Well, I thought because you got started with recycling and environmental issues, I thought you were gonna become an environmental scientist and change the world. You promised.
Dean Regas: Well, that’s right. I did say that at some point, didn’t I?
Stan Regas: Right. He did. That was your promise, Dean, when you graduated.
Becky Regas: High school.
Stan Regas: Yes. They interviewed him and he says, “My name is Dean Regas, and I just graduated, and I’m going to change the world.” And he's gonna change the world. And he did.
Becky Regas: Well, I think you had several phases, Dean. As a young person, you definitely challenged yourself. You timed yourself when you did puzzles and you timed yourself when you did the Rubik’s Cube, etc.
And then you had an entrepreneur stage, where I got a phone call from your elementary school teacher and she said, “Well, Mrs. Regas, we have a situation with your son Dean. He's been selling Jolly Ranchers to the students on the playground, and it’s just not the right thing to do.” So we had to put a stop to that.
Dean Regas: Well, yeah. I mean, the kids needed Jolly Ranchers. I had 'em. Like I gotta mark 'em up a little bit. I mean, that seems pretty obvious.
Becky Regas: That was entrepreneurship. And even in high school, you created—what was it? The Environmental Voice? Do you remember that?
Dean Regas: Oh yeah, my newsletter. That I made, that you produced.
Becky Regas: And so you had this, I think, interest in your world and in the environment, and you cared for it as a young person.
Stan Regas: Well, I think we missed an early clue, Dean, that you were gonna be into astronomy. When you were in grade school, I think, you had a globe the size of a basketball, and you would look at that and turn it and study it and all that. I should have picked up on that. I didn’t. I think that’s where it all started.
Dean Regas: I have that globe still. It’s still—it’s always behind me when I give my classes.
Stan Regas: May be antique. You better hold onto it.
Dean Regas: So, okay, well let’s go forward past our minor gouging of children that I did. And 25 years ago when I told you that I was gonna be an astronomer—that I was an astronomer—now what were your first reactions?
Stan Regas: Well, of course, I was glad you found a profession. What you told me is the fellow—your boss at that time—you told him the same thing: “I don’t know anything about astronomy.”
And he had good words. He says, “You’ll learn.” And you’re good at learning, Dean.
Becky Regas: You really are. And you always have been a self-educated person.
Even though you would tell us you did not care for school, you were always a good student, and you did us proud. We never had any problems with you.
But I think, basically, you just stumbled into this. But it did catch you right away. The passion is there. And so I think one of the things I could say as a parent—and I’m sure Stan agrees—is that we hope for all our children that they find a profession that they love. And that’s what you have done. And that makes us really feel good.
Dean Regas: Whew. Wow. Well, I don’t think I should ask any more questions. I think that’s a pretty good way to wrap that up, don’t you think? That was funny, though, that that was what came back from my test, that I would be a florist.
Uh, but anyway—
Becky Regas: I think you ought to try it, Dean. I think you’d be very successful.
Stan Regas: Well, second career—you show how all the planets could—you know, if they had flowers on them, here’s what they would look like.
I bet you there are flowers on Europa.
Dean Regas: It could be, yeah.
Dean Regas: Looking Up with Dean Regas is a production of Cincinnati Public Radio. Kevin Reynolds and I created the podcast back in 2017. Ella Rowen produces and edits our show and lives by the saying,"One small step for audio quality, one giant leap for perfect podcasts." Jenell Walton is our Vice President of Content, and Ronny Salerno is our Digital Platforms Manager. Our theme song is “Possible Light” by Ziv Moran. Our Social Media Coordinator is Hannah Mcfarland and our cover art is by Nicole Tiffany. I'm Dean Regas, keep looking up!
