On this special bonus episode of Backed Up, your hosts Becca Costello and Ella Rowen chat with local comic book creator Jay Kalagayan.
MeSseD Comics explores the wet, wacky, and weird world of a fictional metropolitan sewer district. It's not officially set in Cincinnati, but Kalagayan says it was the MSD of Greater Cincinnati that inspired his creation.
You can check out the first two seasons for free at messedcomics.com.
See more photos and videos at wvxu.org/backedup
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT:
Backed Up is transcribed using a combination of AI speech recognition and human editors. It may contain errors. Please check the corresponding audio before quoting in print.
Ella Rowen: Well hello again, Poo Crime fans…
Becca Costello: Backed Up is BACK, baby!
Ella Rowen: I’m Ella Rowen.
Becca Costello: I’m Becca Costello, and this is a very special BONUS episode of Backed Up from Cincinnati Public Radio.
Ella Rowen: The only thing more surprising than a podcast about the sewer system is…. A comic book series about the sewer system?
Becca Costello: Yep, it exists. We heard about it from MSD directly.
Ella Rowen: That’s Metropolitan Sewer District of Greater Cincinnati, if you’ve somehow already forgotten all our acronyms.
Becca Costello: It was a cold, cold day, deep underground beneath the Mill Creek Wastewater Treatment Plant…
Treatment plant guide: We have an entire underground network of tunnels that run throughout the entire facility. It is a means to, it's a pipe chase. And it's also how we convey electric and communication lines throughout the plant. It allows us easy access to these pipes for maintenance and also gives us a route that we can walk to which is kind of nice. It's exceedingly rare that I would take someone through the tunnels for tours.
Ella Rowen: As it turns out, at least one other person had this exceedingly rare opportunity…
Deb Leonard: We also have these guys — Messed? Messed comics is these comic book guys who did a comic book based on MSD.
Becca Costello: Oh, that's cool.
Deb Leonard: Based on MSD, yeah.
Becca Costello: We'll have to look that up.
Ella Rowen: Yeah, that's really cool.
Becca Costello: So obviously we found this mysterious comic series and gave it a read. It’s called MeSseD Comics. Get it? MSD with a couple extra letters?
ELLA: Check out this trailer for the comic series…
[Comic trailer]: What occurs after millions of people flush their toilets, wash their food, and clean their clothes? What really happens underground, in the roots of our skyscrapers, away from the prying eyes of camera phones and satellites? Messed is a story that answers those questions.
Ella Rowen: MeSseD Comics is created and written by Jay Kalagayan, with artwork from fellow Cincinnatian Dylan Speeg. We invited Jay to the studio to chat with us!
Becca Costello: Well, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. Can you first just introduce yourself to our audience?
Jay Kalagayan: Hi. My name is Jay B. Kalagayn. I am a Cincinnatian. I went to Xavier University and probably been here about 28 to 30 years. I worked for the Xavier Newswire, for Xavier University, and I got to go out and do the arts, like Cincinnati Playhouse, Ensemble Theater, those kind of things, to review them, and fell in love with the city through its arts.
Becca Costello: Can you just describe the world that you created for MeSseD Comics and kind of give our audience, if they're not familiar with it, what it is and what it looks like?
Jay Kalagayan: Oh, this is so fun. So MeSseD Comics -- MeSseD is the nickname for the Metropolitan Sewer District, and our tour guide, unofficial tour guide, is Lilliput and she's just kind of showing us the weird, wild, wet world beneath our feet. I kind of describe it as, like Tremors, the movie Tremors, matched together like a Tank Girl, Hellboy kind of character. And I did about a year of research, talking with MSD, doing tours of the treatment plant. I had a friend who was an employee, and he took me through some of those tunnels that you were talking about in your podcast. And yes, don't go alone, and don't go when it's rain, anywhere within 100 miles. And then also did SD one, Sanitation District One in Northern Kentucky. I got to shadow the trouble call crew, cap got me in there, and that was just really fun as well. Great learning experiences and so many wonderful people who do this essential work.
Becca Costello: So describe more like the world that Lilliput is in, because it is in some ways similar and familiar to the MSD that we researched for our podcast, but there's also quite a lot in there that we did not see in our podcast. And I would say, thankfully, because it's a little bit dangerous.
Jay Kalagayan: I might exaggerate a little bit, I did a lot of wonderful interviews with people and found out about the things that they deal with and the basic idea behind MeSseD is keep the flow. These essential workers, these filter workers, or sewer workers, they're just keeping the tunnels, and they're keeping the sewage flowing, the wastewater flowing. But they encounter things like, I have sewer worms, and they told me about these sewer worms, and I admit I might have multiplied their size a little bit, maybe a little bit there. And my other favorite was, I call them the filaments. At the treatment plant, there's filamentous bacteria, which is the bacteria they don't want in the tanks, and they're kind of at the top, and they're kind of pesky. And I kind of mutated them a little bit, exaggerated them a little bit so they're almost a humanoid form running around and getting into trouble and messing things up.
Ella Rowen: I love it that actually, that's perfect, because I had a question about that, so that already answers one of them. But there's so much, like, sort of technical vocab in the comics that seems like it could be inspired by things that MSD says. So some of the other ones I wrote down is like effluent,
Jay Kalagayan: Oh, the effluent, yeah. Basically, that's the wastewater going through. Yeah. When I took the tour of the treatment plant, it was, it was eye opening, because I think we're a very flush and forget it society where, you know, we flush our toilets, wash our vegetables, dump water, and we don't think about what happens. So another one of our underlying themes, or our hashtags that we have fun with is follow the flush.
Becca Costello: Are there other examples of like, the kind of technical jargon that is sewer related, but that you kind of twisted or amplified or exaggerated with this fantasy element?
Jay Kalagayan: Let's see here. Well, I don't place it in Cincinnati, even though a lot of the reference and research occurred in Cincinnati and Northern Kentucky. I kind of place it in a different city, because I don't, I don't, I'm not trying to play politics. I'm not having that city county. Well, I will, but, like, not, not placed in Cincinnati. So as far as that, yeah, I'd have to go through, I think one of the, one of my favorite scenes in the second season was a story they told me where I think a company got permission to dump a certain chemical that they needed to, and it caused, basically bubbles, kind of almost like a foam party. And so, like I heard all the pools and everything were just all foam and everything like that. So those are my favorite stories. And then so I incorporated that into season two. Now that story might have occurred, I also did research in Virginia Beach, so I'm not going to put anyone on the spot and say, where did that foam party occur? Oh, and then one of the other fun thing, a little factoid. Fun factoids, the names, so it's Lilliput, Fat Mucket, Sandshell, Three Ridge, a lot of wild names. So when I was working for the Museum Center, they have the Eulett Center out in Adams County, I went out there on a tour, and they had this big board, and I was like, What are these? And they had all these, these shells, and they had these amazing names. They're named after freshwater muscles.
Becca Costello: Oh, wow.
Jay Kalagayan: The filter feeders. They're cleaning the water. So that's where all those names come from. Yeah, it's their code names. So yeah.
Ella Rowen: it really feels like the actual world of wastewater treatment is also a fantasy world in some ways, because I don't know, reading your comic, I was just reminded of so many moments from when Becca and I toured a lot of the same locations, where we would just be like, Whoa. And also kind of back to, like, the jargon, like times when MSD staff would be explaining, like, really complicated scientific stuff. We would be like, we have no idea what they're saying.
Becca Costello: Well, yeah, we have hours and hours of audio from our tour of the labs and the treatment plant that it we didn't end up using in the show, partly because we couldn't explain all of it like it was just too much, but also confusing.
Jay Kalagayan: And I think I'm glad they do tours of the treatment plant. I'm glad that that is something that the public can do, because I feel like people, I think we, the American society, we don't want to smell the landfill, we don't want to smell sewage, but it is, it is part of everyday life. But we don't, we don't play in dirt, you know, it's and we just kind of have stepped away from that, and I feel like I'm not saying, you know, jump right in the sewage or anything like that, but I think we need to have an awareness of that and those and these essential systems, and not forget that they exist, and we need them.
Becca Costello: When you were doing your research to create this world with, like, some of these fantasy elements, how much were you, if at all, concerned about accuracy and like accurately portraying the sewer system.
Jay Kalagayan: I mean, I wanted to get inspired and do a lot of -- with the research and everything, I wanted to be inspired by it. Use a lot of the jargon and everything like that. But admittedly, I place this a little bit more in the future, in a kind of a city, and this is why I don't place it in Cincinnati, a city that doesn't care as much, as long as they keep the flow. So there isn't as much there isn't as much street activity where they're going down in the tunnels. They're pretty much going to the tunnels from underground as well. They're also very solo. Lilliput plays, almost like a sheriff or a deputy, kind of taking care of her territory. So it's very solitary as well. And I know like just working with the trouble call crew and with MSD, I mean, they do teams. It's all about safety there. And I admit, in the world of MeSseD, which is not in Cincinnati, it is, they do not care as much as long as the flow occurs.
Becca Costello: A question that we get all the time when people ask us about the podcast is, why did you make a podcast about sewers? And we have our own answer to that. But now I pose the question to you, why did you make a comic series about sewers? What initially inspired that?
Jay Kalagayan: Well, I would say inspiration came from twofold. I would say, anyone who collects comics, I think, always wants to do a story. It's like, oh, I want to write a comic, or I want to draw a comic, you know, that kind of thing, which is, I mean, I think that's part of the fandom. I think theater fans would with terror and then with honor, would love to hit that stage. So I think with with the comic book readers, I've always wanted to do a comic book. And I was working at the Cincinnati Museum Center, and they're near a treatment plant, and I kept driving by it every day, and I was like, what is happening there? So I got a tour, and everything just clicked. As far as Lilliput as a character, I have two daughters, and I wanted to create a strong character who identifies as female, identifies as Asian, and so when they come with me to the comic book store or the bookstore, or Joseph Beth, they get to see someone who looks like them on the shelves. And that came basically from as a parent, you have the privilege of introducing your children to the things you love, but they also, in turn, reintroduce those things back to you. So you might see like, oh, well, maybe this is a little non equitable as far as gender, or maybe it's a little more homogenized as far as race. And so I wanted to contribute something that they could see themselves in.
Ella Rowen: I have to say, You gave both of us these really cool posters of Lilliput. I framed mine and put it in my bathroom. She inspires me every time I flush, but it's epic. I love seeing it every day. The artwork really is incredible.
Jay Kalagayan: I think WVXU should support your trip to, both Paris and Belgium have sewer museums. I've been to both of them, and they're amazing.
Becca Costello: I agree that they should support those trips.
Jay Kalagayan: You heard it here first, folks. But it's wonderful because I think that civilization is built on two things. Dylan always says this, my artist, Dylan always says this: Civilization is built on two things, the written word and working sewers without those things you can't have civilization. On your podcast, I liked how you mentioned that with these combined sewers and everything like that. I mean, before that, sewers were way closer to people. I mean, it was in the streets. You see those old Victorian TV shows, you know, like reenactments and stuff, and, you know, they were like, just dumping stuff right in the street. So it is amazing how the system that we created 100 years ago is even functional in ways. So it is a really impressive.
Ella Rowen: My final question is, is there like a central takeaway that you want readers to have about the sewer system, just generally when they read your comic?
Jay Kalagayan: I think, as a writer, I try to, we have the three Es. We want to first entertain. I mean, that's what the comics for, and that's why I read comics. But I think there's definitely an element of education. So it's just like, you might ask more questions than I might answer, but it's like, well, wait a minute, what does happen after you flush? Let's find out about these systems and the fact that there are miles and miles of tunnels underneath us. And then there's that third area, which is enlightenment. I mean, hopefully MeSseD Comics inspires you to learn more, to create your own thing, or just inspires you to go out and read more stories.
Ella Rowen: If you want to dive into the wet, wacky, and weird world of MeSseD Comics, you can check out the first two seasons for free on their website at messedcomics.com.
Becca Costello: So hey, it’s been a whole year since we released Backed Up, and a lot has happened since then.
[Hot Ones Clip]: Look at us. Hey, look at us. Who would’ve thought? Not me.
Ella Rowen: We were nominated for a WEBBY Award! That means Backed Up was in the top 12-percent of more than 13,000 entries all over the world.
Becca Costello: We also got to reach a national audience with this reporting - Backed Up was featured on Science Friday AND on NPR’s Weekend All Things Considered. There's also one more that kind of blew our minds.
Ella Rowen: Call it a Christmas Miracle, because on December 24, The Atlantic named Backed Up one of the Top 20 podcasts of 2024.
Becca Costello: Literally wtf.
Ella Rowen: But one of the coolest things has been getting to meet some of our listeners, like at the grand opening of Cincinnati Public Radio’s brand new building in April.
Becca Costello: And we’ll get to do that again very soon! Come see me and Ella at the Albert Pyle Urban Lecture at the Mercantile Library on Thursday, July 10 at 6 o’clock.
Ella Rowen: You can check out the event on the library’s website at mercantilelibrary.com
Becca Costello: And that will be the last time Ella and I speak.
Ella Rowen: We’ll finally be free of each other.
Becca Costello: Is that funny?
Ella Rowen: Yeah, I like it.
Becca Costello: They'll get it, right?
Ella Rowen: Mhmm.
Becca Costello: Backed Up is a Cincinnati Public Radio podcast, produced with support from PRX and made possible (in part) by a grant from the John S. and James L. Knight Foundation.
Ella Rowen: Backed Up is reported and produced by Becca Costello and Ella Rowen, with support from Casey Kuhn.
Becca Costello: A lot of people helped put this podcast together: Leslie Smith, Tana Weingartner, Jenn Merritt, Ronny Salerno, Zack Carreon, Marshall Verbsky, Stephen Baum, Assia Micheaux-Johnson, Brittany Mayti, and Kevin Reynolds.
Ella Rowen: Maryanne Zeleznik is our VP of News. Jenell Walton is our VP of content. Nicole Tiffany made our podcast cover art. Special thanks to Sam Ransohoff, Toni Carlson, Grace Abler, Stephanie Kuo, and Mike Russo.
Becca Costello: Go to wvxu.org/backedup to find a transcript of this episode.
